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IDProjectCategoryLast Update
0003888Valley 1Gameplay IdeaJan 25, 2012 12:50 pm
Reportertigersfan Assigned ToChris_McElligottPark  
Status resolvedResolutionfixed 
Summary0003888: Higher tiered spells relatively underpowered?
DescriptionI wanted some feedback from others on this. I feel like once your spells move past tier I, they are a bit underpowered relative to the previous tier. What I mean is for example: On level 1, I can take out a level 1 esper with 2 or at most 3 fireballs. But, at level 5, with the tier II fireball spell, facing an equal level esper again, it takes 4 or 5 hits to take him out. This might be ok against espers, but against tougher enemies like minibosses (or even higher), this means it can take a LOT more hits. This becomes a further problem once you hit say level 8 or 9, when the bosses are even tougher, but you still maybe haven't gotten the tier III stuff.

On the other hand, maybe I'm just whining and need to suck it up and deal. What do others think?
TagsNo tags attached.
Internal WeightDiscussion Only

Activities

Chris_McElligottPark

Sep 21, 2011 4:58 pm

administrator   ~0013306

Hmm, it really should stay more consistent. The power level on these is being multiplied by the tier linearly. So if a spell does 100 damage at tier 1, it does 200 damage at tier 2.

Perhaps the scaling factor is not high enough to compensate for the way that enemy health generally scales now, I'm not sure.

tigersfan

Sep 21, 2011 5:03 pm

reporter   ~0013307

Want me to make it official than? And take it out of the realm of discussion only?

Chris_McElligottPark

Sep 21, 2011 5:05 pm

administrator   ~0013308

Sure, that is fine with me. Although, without more data or testing, I don't have any particular thoughts on what to do with this yet. Care to do the math?

tigersfan

Sep 21, 2011 5:07 pm

reporter   ~0013309

I don't mind doing the math, but, I'm not sure where to get the exact numbers from. Is there somewhere other than in game to get them?

Chris_McElligottPark

Sep 21, 2011 5:20 pm

administrator   ~0013310

Well, here's an example to balance around:

Esper RateOfMaxHealthIncrease = 7

Health formula:
HpPerLevel = 100 - 80 + ( RateOfMaxHealthIncrease * 16 );
MaxHealth = 100 + ( hpPerLevel * EnemyLevel );

Whereas your human PlayerMagicDamagePerLevel varies from 1-10, and translates to actual firepower as follows:

PlayerMagicDamage = PlayerMagicDamagePerLevel * 3 * this.EffectiveLevel

SpellDamage, on the other hand, is just SpellDamagePerTier * Tier.

Final MagicDamage from a player attack is PlayerMagicDamage + SpellDamage

The power of the spell versus your innate power has to be additive and not multiplicative to avoid getting an exponential increase in power as tiers go up.

My guess is that SpellDamagePerTier * Tier needs to be modified in some way, but I'm not sure what a sensible multiplier would be there. And the multiplier might need to only kick in after tier 1. So it might be that the final formula is something like ( ( ( Tier - 1 ) * UnknownValue ) + SpellDamagePerTier ) * Tier

Thoughts? I'm off for a bit, but will be back in an hour or so. Currently working in a different area (the undergrounds thing).

tigersfan

Sep 21, 2011 5:48 pm

reporter   ~0013311

Last edited: Sep 21, 2011 5:49 pm

Hmmm, maybe I'm just imagining things, because unless I did the math wrong, it's pretty consistent. Here's what I got:

Esper
Level 1 - HPPL = 112 Max Health = 212
Level 5 Max Health = 660
Level 10 Max Health = 1220
Level 15 Max Health = 1780

Player - MagicDamagePerLevel assumption 6. SpellDamagePerTeir assumption 60.
Level 1 player
PlayerMagicDamage=18
Final MagicDamage=78
Shots to kill equal level esper - 3

Level 5 Player - tier II spells
PlayerMagicDamage=90
Final MagicDamage=298
Shots to kill equal level esper - 4

Level 10 Player - tier III spells
PlayerMagicDamage=180
Final MagicDamage=360
Shots to kill equal level esper - 4

Level 15 Player - tier IV spells
PlayerMagicDamage=270
Final MagicDamage=510
Shots to kill equal level esper - 4

I'm off for a bit too, perhaps for the night.

Chris_McElligottPark

Sep 21, 2011 6:20 pm

administrator   ~0013312

It could be that your new character (if it's a new character) really stinks at magic more. Or something like that. The character's skill at magic may make more of a difference the higher the levels are, I'm not sure.

tigersfan

Jan 25, 2012 12:50 pm

reporter   ~0018105

Not an issue anymore.

Issue History

Date Modified Username Field Change
Sep 21, 2011 4:53 pm tigersfan New Issue
Sep 21, 2011 4:54 pm tigersfan Status new => feedback
Sep 21, 2011 4:58 pm Chris_McElligottPark Note Added: 0013306
Sep 21, 2011 5:03 pm tigersfan Note Added: 0013307
Sep 21, 2011 5:03 pm tigersfan Status feedback => new
Sep 21, 2011 5:05 pm Chris_McElligottPark Note Added: 0013308
Sep 21, 2011 5:07 pm tigersfan Note Added: 0013309
Sep 21, 2011 5:08 pm tigersfan Internal Weight Discussion Only => Polish Tweak
Sep 21, 2011 5:08 pm tigersfan Assigned To => Chris_McElligottPark
Sep 21, 2011 5:08 pm tigersfan Status new => assigned
Sep 21, 2011 5:20 pm Chris_McElligottPark Note Added: 0013310
Sep 21, 2011 5:48 pm tigersfan Note Added: 0013311
Sep 21, 2011 5:49 pm tigersfan Note Edited: 0013311
Sep 21, 2011 5:49 pm tigersfan Note Edited: 0013311
Sep 21, 2011 6:20 pm Chris_McElligottPark Note Added: 0013312
Sep 22, 2011 7:28 pm Chris_McElligottPark Internal Weight Polish Tweak => Discussion Only
Jan 25, 2012 12:50 pm tigersfan Note Added: 0018105
Jan 25, 2012 12:50 pm tigersfan Status assigned => resolved
Jan 25, 2012 12:50 pm tigersfan Resolution open => fixed
Apr 14, 2014 9:30 am Chris_McElligottPark Category Suggestion - Gameplay => Gameplay Idea