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IDProjectCategoryLast Update
0028414Heart Of The MachineGameplay IssueMay 26, 2024 10:59 am
ReporterBobtree Assigned ToChris_McElligottPark  
Status resolvedResolutionfixed 
Product Version0.521 Mental Energy Visibility 
Fixed in Version0.523 The Sunday Testers 
Summary0028414: homicide investigation "Remaining Turns to Fight" objective is confusing.
DescriptionIt's not clear what the turn count means or what the player should do here.
Kill the investigators? Let them fight for X turns? Or will they just leave after X turns?
I can see the mission countdown is the same number of turns as on the Homicide Investigation map icon.
It's not clear whether the fight or the investigation is what ends the lockdown. The Event Log shows lots of attacks but few deaths.

I attached a save from Turn 3, both factions fighting, with 2 "remaining" turns and 77% progress on the Investigation icon.
Load this save, look to the left and click the leftmost detective, then there's an "Evidence Collected" popup and progress rises to 86%. Why?
Wiggle your units to use up their AP and end the turn, then the combat ends, and you get a Mission Failed notification.
I thought the purpose of starting this fight was to hinder the investigation, but it completes anyway.

Is there no wrong choice? It's fine to tell the player "do something fast, anything will work" to get the ball rolling, but I wasted a lot of time here trying to understand what happened.
TagsNo tags attached.

Activities

Bobtree

May 26, 2024 12:21 am

reporter  

Autosave Landing Turn 3.save (3,662,299 bytes)

Chris_McElligottPark

May 26, 2024 12:26 am

administrator   ~0068653

image.png (250,279 bytes)   
image.png (250,279 bytes)   

Chris_McElligottPark

May 26, 2024 12:35 am

administrator   ~0068654

So, in general, it says you're supposed to stop the investigators from investigating.

The investigators are labeled.

They walk around collecting evidence, and every time they do, the progress towards their investigation being completed rises. You noticed this correlation, but I'm... not sure what I'm missing, in return. Investigators collect evidence, and investigation progress is made. I'm just really confused about what's confusing, since you made the connection I would think could be missed.

The rebels and the defenders shoot at each other, and the investigators also get hit, but not every investigator dies if you do this.

I would think that the logical conclusion is to shoot the investigators, given this chain of logic.

But what I suspect is happening is that some sort of information was missing from the chain of logic. Which step(s) were lacking or buried?

---

On the subject of what happens if you just stand around, etc, you're right, that's not really clearly specified at all. Originally I didn't want to, in order to keep the sense of uncertainty around. But given this is the first one, I think it makes sense to explain what is up.

Basically, the answers to your questions are:

- If you fail the mission and the investigators do their work and leave, nothing bad happens to you. The lockdown lifts, their job is done, they go on their way, you go on yours.
- If you win the mission and prevent the investigators from gathering what they want before their time limit is up, then you get a juicy upgrade from a random pool.

My guess is that the general opaqueness of this kind of put you in a headspace where you were spinning your wheels a bit, possibly also because this is so early in the game and there's a bunch of other stuff that is completely fresh to you. I'm having trouble figuring out what to do about some of this, because it seems to me like you made the leaps I thought would be harder, but then the next inferences from that were not clear to you.

Possibly this is a case of the information coming to you in a disordered manner, which makes it harder to synthesize what the heck is going on with something like this. If that's the case, then perhaps some sort of "What is happening with the investigation" entry near the other stuff above, which lays out what is going on and what the stakes are, linearly and briefly, might solve this issue.

If you had this issue, then people with a far more passing interest in the game will have it in spades. So I'm really trying to understand what is up, because you're not going to be the only one this happens to.

Bobtree

May 26, 2024 1:42 am

reporter   ~0068669

It seems like the fiction excuse to make the player fight clashes with the goal.

They were investigating a murder, so I thought I would lay low and avoid additional murder. My one bot that started the fight would be destroyed, leaving the rest in the clear, so I didn't fight the investigators directly. I get that it's about ending the lockdown quickly, but IDK why causing a bloodbath would resolve that. My intuition is that that murdering investigators should draw attention, not make them quit, and I wanted to avoid discovery. My initial thought was that the investigation would clear on its own and end the lockdown, because your android wasn't involved, but the player is forced into combat.

"Remaining turns to fight" is the odd bit, because I didn't kill them or run out of turns. Attacking the rebel is presented as an alternative to directly slaying the investigators, and it does start a big fight, but they don't pause the investigation, so I failed because the investigation progress reached 100%.

I assumed that fighting the Rebels would be enough to delay them, but the Rebels are just additional firepower and not an alternative to fighting yourself. I had tried to run out the clock passively.

Only when replaying the prologue did I understand the progress% and Investigation Turns Left were linked to the Remaining Turns To Fight objective. It might be clearer if the Turns were not listed in 2 different places. Maybe rename the goal to "Stop the Investigation: X% Progress" (or invert it, "Y% Remaining"), with X Turns Remaining in the tooltip, so the player doesn't try to delay like I did. Or else make the rebels pause the investigation so you can succeed by involving them to run out the clock.

Chris_McElligottPark

May 26, 2024 10:41 am

administrator   ~0068685

This is SMART -- the stop the investigation wording. This is great feedback, thank you!

Chris_McElligottPark

May 26, 2024 10:56 am

administrator   ~0068687

image-2.png (590,393 bytes)

Chris_McElligottPark

May 26, 2024 10:57 am

administrator   ~0068689

image-3.png (421,955 bytes)

Chris_McElligottPark

May 26, 2024 10:59 am

administrator   ~0068690

* The wording around the investigation progress during the prologue has been reworked a lot, to make it clear what the stakes are and are not, and who is doing what and why.
** Hopefully this should make it clear what the goals are, and what you get if you win, versus what you stand to lose if you fail. This was all very opaque, previously.
** Big thanks to Bobtree for the specific suggestions and points on where things were unclear or seemed to clash with the narrative elements.

Issue History

Date Modified Username Field Change
May 26, 2024 12:21 am Bobtree New Issue
May 26, 2024 12:21 am Bobtree File Added: Autosave Landing Turn 3.save
May 26, 2024 12:26 am Chris_McElligottPark Note Added: 0068653
May 26, 2024 12:26 am Chris_McElligottPark File Added: image.png
May 26, 2024 12:35 am Chris_McElligottPark Note Added: 0068654
May 26, 2024 12:35 am Chris_McElligottPark Assigned To => Chris_McElligottPark
May 26, 2024 12:35 am Chris_McElligottPark Status new => feedback
May 26, 2024 1:42 am Bobtree Note Added: 0068669
May 26, 2024 10:41 am Chris_McElligottPark Note Added: 0068685
May 26, 2024 10:56 am Chris_McElligottPark Note Added: 0068687
May 26, 2024 10:56 am Chris_McElligottPark File Added: image-2.png
May 26, 2024 10:57 am Chris_McElligottPark Note Added: 0068689
May 26, 2024 10:57 am Chris_McElligottPark File Added: image-3.png
May 26, 2024 10:59 am Chris_McElligottPark Status feedback => resolved
May 26, 2024 10:59 am Chris_McElligottPark Resolution open => fixed
May 26, 2024 10:59 am Chris_McElligottPark Fixed in Version => 0.523 The Sunday Testers
May 26, 2024 10:59 am Chris_McElligottPark Note Added: 0068690