View Issue Details
| ID | Project | Category | Date Submitted | Last Update | |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| 0001192 | AI War 1 / Classic | Balance Issue | Nov 8, 2010 5:35 pm | Feb 17, 2011 9:16 pm | |
| Reporter | Chris_McElligottPark | Assigned To | Chris_McElligottPark | ||
| Status | resolved | Resolution | fixed | ||
| Fixed in Version | 4.046 | ||||
| Summary | 0001192: Rebalance MRS and Engineers. | ||||
| Description | Most likely at this point: 1. Make engineers cease functioning on planets with an enemy command station. 2. Make Mobile Repair Stations (MRS) have a 30-second "deployment" and "pack up" phase. They can then only do repairs while deployed, but can't move. This won't be in for a couple of weeks, so there is time to discuss. Originally from: http://www.arcengames.com/forums/index.php/topic,7538.0.html | ||||
| Tags | No tags attached. | ||||
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Request that Mk3 and "Exp" engies still be able to work on a hostile world (and teleport) :) Request that the MRS be cloakable while not in repair mode ie. in mobile/deploy/packup modes |
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"2.Make Mobile Repair Stations (MRS) have a 30-second "deployment" and "pack up" phase. They can then only do repairs while deployed, but can't move." This sounds like a fantastic idea! MRS was borderline OP in my little experience. Pros: *Cheap for the services they procure. *Great range and speed. *Can repair an infinite number of ships in range, at the same time, to full health, at lightning speed and on the move. *Are not the main target of the AI while accompanying your forces. *Are indirectly an amazing economic upgrade. *MRS Cap of 9 is more than enough. Cons: *Ships must not have been harmed for a few seconds to be repaired. *Cannot be repaired and take 1 full hour to regenerate (I always get rid of a low health MRS and build another) In my opinion, the Pros far outweigh the Cons and makes it a must have. I would like to add though that they require a moderately annoying amount of micro which does not go hand in hand with the “no painful micromanagement” trend of the game. This is alleviated by its good repair range: *Putting an MRS in FRD does absolutely nothing (It will just stand there, while a FRD Engineer will seek friendlies to repair). *Ordering a Fleet+MRS to attack (X) with waypoints will result in the MRS never stopping till it reaches the end of the last waypoint, often leaving the rest of the fleet behind since MRS don't stop to attack anything (even worse if you don't Group-Move due to his great speed). And last, since MRS cannot produce Tugs anymore, the CTRLS---> MRS-Repaired Ships Stay At The MRS has been rendered useless (as far as I know). Maybe, with the changes you are about to make, you could add the option to make ships with less than 33% health rally any MRS in the system (and then the first option would make sense again). Sorry for the long comment, not sure if its the best place for lengthy opinions ^^. PS: Could you include the repair & Construction Ranges of Engineers and MRS's Tooltip with this future balance update? Not a big deal but it would be nice :). |
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I think I agree with Heavens. |
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in the 4.031 release thread on the forums Ozymandiaz suggested "making FF bearers immune to repair and giving them a natural regen rate." This would address the issue of the MRS + FF bearers "killer combo". Also I have to disagree with Heavens on the MRS not being the main target of the AI when accompanying your fleets. In my current 4.031 game I've lost more than a few MRS. Their low regen rate & lack of repairing make them quite vulnerable when the AI picks on them. I do however think their repair range is a bit obscene but this is balanced at present by the lack of an FRD mode. For a 4k Knowledge unlock they're a little overpowered when combined with some specific other units but the key point here is "combined with other units". If you don't have FF bearers to soak up the damage the AI sends towards your fleet, they're no longer ridiculously overpowered. |
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I think the AI should just prioritize shooting engineers but the MRS might need the nerf. I usually retreat into friendly territory and use a bunch of engies for repairs. Engineers are mandatory for science MkIII, disabling them when an enemy command station is present would impact the MkIII heavily. |
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Good catch on the SciLab3 so I have edited my 1st post to include mk3 engies and exp engies keep teleport and ability to work on hostile worlds |
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Actually engineers not working on a hostile world is probably going to make "beachheads" in general very hard as FF will not be repaired unless dragged back through the WH and all built units like SciLab3 will be unassistable Could turn into a lot of micro (moving through the WH for repair) and pain (buildable structures) |
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If we did cut engineers from hostile worlds we'd have to re-examine the build time on Mk3 science labs, as they're currently balanced for engineer assists. FF generators wouldn't be much of an issue. You push a fresh one into the hostile world and retreat the damaged one for repairs. It'd actually work better than bringing engineers with, due to the damaged-repair-delay. |
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Thanks for the thoughts, all. Here's what I did: * Engineers mark I-III now take 4x as much damage when on enemy planets. This makes them still just as useful while on beachheads or in other protected circumstances where they are under forcefields or whatever and thus not taking fire while in enemy territory. But it makes them vastly less effective in actual combat situations, so that they don't work well mixed in with your main fleet WHILE it is attacking. However, on defense and on player planets they are just as effective as ever, which is also important. * The multi-repair-range of superfortresses has been doubled, although it's still much smaller than that of the other fortresses. That's simply not its primary function. ** Thanks to Toll for suggesting. * SuperFortresses, Fortresses, and Mobile Repair Stations now have to remain stationary to do their multi-repairs. After moving, they must recharge for 60 seconds before they can start doing repairs again: it's best to find a good position for them and leave them there until you're ready to deploy them in a new locale. In the case of fortresses/superfortresses, this doesn't affect their ability to attack while stationary or moving. ** The intent here is to keep mobile repair stations from being used as mobile heal-instantly fleet-life extenders. Of course, comments welcome, but probably best to have further topics for any further changes needed to these. |
| Date Modified | Username | Field | Change |
|---|---|---|---|
| Nov 8, 2010 5:35 pm | Chris_McElligottPark | New Issue | |
| Nov 8, 2010 5:35 pm | Chris_McElligottPark | Status | new => assigned |
| Nov 8, 2010 5:35 pm | Chris_McElligottPark | Assigned To | => Chris_McElligottPark |
| Nov 8, 2010 9:39 pm | Winter Born | Note Added: 0003030 | |
| Nov 8, 2010 11:35 pm | Heavens | Note Added: 0003036 | |
| Nov 9, 2010 12:55 pm | Draco18s | Note Added: 0003080 | |
| Nov 11, 2010 7:04 am | Malibu Stacey | Note Added: 0003229 | |
| Nov 11, 2010 7:53 am | Malibu Stacey | Note Edited: 0003229 | |
| Nov 12, 2010 11:14 am | KDR_11k | Note Added: 0003278 | |
| Nov 14, 2010 2:16 pm | Winter Born | Note Added: 0003453 | |
| Nov 14, 2010 2:17 pm | Winter Born | Note Edited: 0003030 | |
| Nov 18, 2010 11:16 am | Winter Born | Note Added: 0003892 | |
| Nov 18, 2010 11:27 am | Draco18s | Note Added: 0003893 | |
| Dec 6, 2010 8:01 pm | Chris_McElligottPark | Note Added: 0005485 | |
| Dec 6, 2010 8:01 pm | Chris_McElligottPark | Status | assigned => resolved |
| Dec 6, 2010 8:01 pm | Chris_McElligottPark | Fixed in Version | => 4.046 |
| Dec 6, 2010 8:01 pm | Chris_McElligottPark | Resolution | open => fixed |
| Apr 14, 2014 9:29 am | Chris_McElligottPark | Category | Gameplay - Balance Issue => Balance Issue |
