View Issue Details
| ID | Project | Category | Date Submitted | Last Update | |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| 0002279 | AI War 1 / Classic | Suggestion - Balance Tweaks | Jan 7, 2011 7:21 pm | Jan 7, 2011 9:21 pm | |
| Reporter | Sunshine | Assigned To | keith.lamothe | ||
| Status | closed | Resolution | no change required | ||
| Product Version | 4.062 | ||||
| Summary | 0002279: MLRS Bonuses | ||||
| Description | MLRS have a little less than four times the DPS of missile frigates these days, but I'm finding that over the course of an hour and a half long game against 2 difficulty 9 (schizophrenic) opponents that the missile frigates are performing a bit better than the MLRS units, racking up about 33% more kills so far (the missile frigates also have greater survivability statistically in this game!). The main cause is probably the wide range of bonuses missile frigates have, and the size of those bonuses. Against a specialized target, the four specialized targets the MLRS has being shared by the missile frigate as well (plus the missile frigate has bonuses against composite and refractive), the MLRS is doing a bit less than x8 DPS over normal frigate damage, but the frigate gets a x10 bonus, and as a result does quite a decent bit more damage (12k at mk1). The range of missile frigates compared to MLRS also helps matters. Suggest that if MLRS are supposed to function as a sort of "Missile Frigate+," then simply bump damage bonuses up to x3 or x4, which will make the comparison x12 or x16 against x10, and would probably help to mitigate the range advantage of the missile frigates. | ||||
| Tags | No tags attached. | ||||
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I wrote out a reply but mantis ate it. Basically: - MLRS are not missile-frigate+, they're their own unit with more of an ability to fire on many targets in a short time, and have more general-purpose firepower. - A cap of MLRS firing on non-bonus types does roughly 2.5x the dps that a cap of missle frigates does firing on non-bonus types. - When firing on bonus-types, it's 0.5x the dps. - This seems fine to me. - Missile frigates do have a lot of bonuses, several were added recently in response to a widespread feeling that missile frigates were really weak. Since that feeling seems to still be there I'm not feeling like nerfing them will help much. And I don't see a particular need to buff the MLRS. |
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Folks, feel free to vote this one up if you think MLRS need to be stronger. I'm assuming nobody really thinks missile frigates need to be weaker, but correct me if I'm wrong :) |
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Missile frigates seem to be hit-or-miss on effectiveness, depending on what bonus type ships the AI got. In fact, the kill:death ration of the triangle ships varies wildly from game to game because of that. Thus, it is hard for me to judge just how good missile frigates are. |
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Sunshine: bear in mind, also, that the relative effectiveness of all unit types fluctuates a lot based on the different opposing forces. I'm not saying that disproves what you're saying, I'm not really sure to be honest, but it's something to just keep in mind when thinking about balance in general. |
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Oh, and more on topic, I'm happy with MRLSs right now. They are much more general purpose than missile frigates. IMHO, they do that job pretty well; are no uber ship, but still very much worth using. |
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Keith's comment makes sense. I'd been working under the assumption the MLRS are supposed to be a Missile Frigate+ kind of unit, so it was a little strange to see the kill ratios. For current role, if they're not competing with missile frigates, they're probably fine. I also do realize that effectiveness varies from game-to-game, and there are a lot of edge cases in which some of the weaker ships perform astonishingly well, but unless you end up against a Zenith Descendant or Neinzul Youngster you'll see a lot of the triangle ships coming back at you, so you can probably get a general feel for how it'll stack up against the likely scenarios that you'll see in-game. |
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Sounds like this one is okay, then. |
| Date Modified | Username | Field | Change |
|---|---|---|---|
| Jan 7, 2011 7:21 pm | Sunshine | New Issue | |
| Jan 7, 2011 8:26 pm | keith.lamothe | Note Added: 0007808 | |
| Jan 7, 2011 8:27 pm | keith.lamothe | Note Added: 0007809 | |
| Jan 7, 2011 8:27 pm | keith.lamothe | Assigned To | => keith.lamothe |
| Jan 7, 2011 8:27 pm | keith.lamothe | Status | new => feedback |
| Jan 7, 2011 8:28 pm | TechSY730 | Note Added: 0007810 | |
| Jan 7, 2011 8:29 pm | Chris_McElligottPark | Note Added: 0007811 | |
| Jan 7, 2011 8:30 pm | TechSY730 | Note Added: 0007812 | |
| Jan 7, 2011 9:08 pm | Sunshine | Note Added: 0007836 | |
| Jan 7, 2011 9:08 pm | Sunshine | Status | feedback => assigned |
| Jan 7, 2011 9:21 pm | Chris_McElligottPark | Note Added: 0007843 | |
| Jan 7, 2011 9:21 pm | Chris_McElligottPark | Status | assigned => closed |
| Jan 7, 2011 9:21 pm | Chris_McElligottPark | Resolution | open => no change required |
